Nobody signs up for social isolation when they transition
Wednesday, 12 Mar 2025
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Lots of spaces are to a high degree about aesthetics and appearances. If your ingroup status isn’t immediately visible you see very quick how the outgroup is treated
It feels like trans women often get more shit from people outside the queer community, but that trans men tend to get more from within it. And that sucks.
See, *this* is the male loneliness epidemic. It’s not the incels going “REEEEEE I CAN’T GET LAID!” They’re just doing what they always do.
It’s how men get inherently viewed as dangerous, and get treated with this distsnce and wariness by society.
Like, can someone throw up that post by a trans-man’s experiences both pre- and post-transition? Talking about he was treated so much more kindly when presenting as a woman, and so much more coldly when all that changed was that he looked masc now.
I’ve noticed this and it’s really sad. I’ve noticed when you speak up about stuff like this, people will tell you that’s just part of being a man. I don’t think social isolation and villainization should be considered part of it. That’s like saying objectification and diminishment is part of being a woman. It can be an experience you have, but it’s not what you should be defined by and should expect.
And if it is really being ‘part of it’ then why don’t we change that instead of continuing to perpetuate it, considering we’re supposed to be progressive. Masculinity is not inherently toxic or something shameful, it is just a way of being, like let men be bro.
MEN ARE NOT INHERENTLY BAD, AND WOMEN ARE NOT INHERENTLY GOOD. CHOOSING TO TRANSITION DOES NOT CHANGE WHAT KIND OF PERSON YOU ARE OTHER THAN LETTING YOU BE HAPPIER
Everybody wonders “where are the trans men?!” and the answer is we’re at home, because none of y’all can comprehend that a man exists that understands what it’s like to navigate the world as a woman. The only time people bother to affirm our gender is when it can be held against us maliciously. 5 years on T has more or less obliterated my social circle because my “friends” started treating me like shit the more I passed.
I can’t imagine that these people would be okay with telling a trans woman to dress more masc, so why are they okay with telling a trans man the equivalent?
Male loneliness is a huge problem and it’s weird to see people being dismissive about it because it’s happening to a trans guy. It’s bad when it happens to cis guys too! No man should be isolated just because he’s a guy!
Isn’t this part of the toxic masculinity we’re supposed to be fighting against? Men aren’t inherently bad because they’re men, and they deserve a space to feel like themselves.
The bad news; this is how men are treated in general.
The good news; the more people we get realizing this, the more readily we can change it.
transitioning FTM does mean signing up for the male experience as an MTF. Yeah, that sucks.
this isn’t a trans issue. it’s a dude issue, and that makes it way harder to deal with.
Trans inclusive radical misandrists it seem
I mean that the LGBTQ community got batshit insane isn’t something new. I mean I’m bi and for some that’s akin to a insult.
It’s interesting to read this because I’m a trans woman and I’ve felt isolated from anything ‘queer spaces’ regardless of whether people percieved me as masculine or not. I’ve never quite identified what it is that people don’t like about me, but I think it’s that I’ve always just wanted to be a pretty basic woman and don’t fit into the ingroup of ‘queer’. Social isolation is unfortunately pretty real because other places full of cis ppl are dangerous if you want to come out, and it’s hard to get close to anyone while hiding such a big part of your past.
While it’s good this conversation is being had, I worry about the people who will take this to heart solely because it’s a trans man speaking up, and who will still continue to find new ways to isolate and discriminate against the cis queer men.
Unfortunately it’s easy to ignore the bad parts of your friends or a community when you’re not the one it’s being directed at. We all want to believe in the goodness of people we like.
I had a friend who liked dark humor who made a new friend that I could tell was a bigot. The new friend made a gay joke and I pointed out that he seemed to really mean it, and my buddy dismissed me when I pointed it out only for that new friend to say “No I do hate gay people, don’t you?”
Edit: For context I lived in a very conservative country back then and “friend that makes gay jokes but isn’t actively homophobic” was about as good as it got
AMAB masc enby here. I just wanted to throw in that it’s not all bad: I haven’t received any sort of negativity in any sort of queer spaces and always feel very comfortable and accepted. (Though I am autistic so maybe someone’s been passive aggressive at me, and I didn’t realise, but I doubt it!)
I’m part of the leadership for a poety society, which happens to be very queer, but I think it’s a space not focused on that we create an accepting society without thinking too much about those who don’t tick off the boxes. I’m not attempting to imply that groups focusing on queerness are a bad idea, just that it helps to not need everyone to be queer, just to have an interest and respect for it.
I do think it’s about the type of people that run these spaces and that there are places where this doesn’t happen, though it might be, unfortunately, the minority.
It’s almost as if misandry *does* exist.
Nobody signed up for it but it’s the masculine experience™ as a man you’re constantly seen as dangerous or you’re a predator I’ve been excluded myself a ton as a bi guy, doesn’t help I’m a 5 foot 8 black guy who’s 230 and muscular which means the only people who interact with me in queer spaces especially online are not the people I want to associate with. I am more than my race I don’t want to be a bull to a 50-year-old couple nor do I want to “turn you gay” Jeff you’re 30 with 2 kids, or my favorite I’m just a ____ guy playing and maybe I’m just jaded but I’ve stopped trying or interacting in queer spaces altogether.
Yes, unfortunately that is how men are treated in today’s social climate. It’s sad and it sucks, but it’s hard to speak up about it without being labelled an incel or a supporter of the patriarchy. And so we suffer in silence to stop from being alienated even more.
I don’t really get this. Like how can queer spaces be against masculinity when gay and bisexual men make up a sizable and usually pretty visible part of the queer community?
I broke up with my ex (or at least one of the reasons) because she kept fucking/dating pretransition trans mascs and then becoming less welcoming and dumping them when they started masculinizing (we were polyam)
Passing as a man means you’re now viewed as a man
And as a man, many on Tumblr consider you the *enemy*
Have fun with that mental gymnastics
This is just as stupid as the thing with bisexuals in opposite sex relationships. Suddenly you don’t belong anymore
“men suck” discourse hurting men
Bisexual cis man, I’ve spent my whole life defending a community that constantly tells me I don’t belong
Isolated and viewed as a threat.
Welcome, brother.
Not just a trans thing, happens to any masculine presenting person.
Tge male experience in queer spacesTM. Of course this isn’t universal but I noticed that communities with like a 50/50 or a 40/60 (doesn’t matter which side) split of queer and straight folk are like tge best ones with least drama. Again this ain’t universal but it’s funny how my raid group in ff14 which is 50% girls and 50% normal ass guys is way more chill than “safe space” on campus.
How do we fix this?? Cis and trans men both complain about the social isolation that comes with masculinity, so what would be the possible solutions? Would 3rd spaces fix this too?